UAP Release 04 Audio Recording (DVIDS 111830092)

Okay, this is take number 14, tenuation of section 23.0 with Jack Schmidt. Okay, flight data file, CSM. Generally, I have nothing but praise for the flight data file, both vehicles. There was very, very few things that one could have asked for to improve that data file for the 4-poil 17 at any rate. One comment on the flight plan supplement. We had split pages for a number of the logging medical and food logging, and that probably was a mistake. I think the idea was fairly good initially, but the pages we tended to only use that in the book as a whole, and it was a good place to keep them. Also, the pages, if you had wanted them split, were too thin to maintain the split, and they tended to fall out of the book. I would recommend either not splitting or having heavier paper if you want them split. We had an extra Q-card bill for panel 229. I think it was an excellent card that summarized the circuit breaker functions both on 229 and on panel 8, because we had no systems and anomalies of any significance that would relate to that card. It was not used, but I would strongly recommend it's availability, if only for training during SEMS. It's a good quick review of what you lose or retain for those two panels. In the flight plan, I added some pen and ink cues along the margins for certain observational targets that I particularly wanted to look at. These were independent of any designated experiment. I entered them as a function of time. That seemed to work very well for me. I think that kind of thing is an individual preference item. If you have experimented ought to be flight plan, if you're just planning to use your spare time for specific observational targets or types of observations, then I think the pen and ink is maybe the easiest way to go since it shouldn't concern any large number of people. We, Gordy Fullerton, fixed up the circular orbital Q-card for me with a similar designation of craters as a function of time. I did not use that, not because it wasn't a good idea, but because of familiarity with the moon, which came very quickly after a couple orbits. You could recognize your position on the moon fairly easily as a function of each rev either the time in the rev, th a similar designation of craters as a function of time. I did not use that, not because it wasn't a good idea, but because of familiarity with the moon, which came very quickly after a couple orbits. You could recognize your position on the moon fairly easily as a function of each rev either the time in the rev, or a approximate time since sunset, or just because you could look out the window and tell where you were. In the limb, we, the same comments apply. I think all the flight data file items were excellent. I did not use the data card book to the extent that I know I was using on 15 and maybe on 16. We logged most of our specific items such as alignment data and comparable kinds of things in the checklist at the point where they were collected rather than in the data book and had no this did not seem to raise any difficulty at any time. The cuff checklist we've talked about, I think, in the surface items. I thought the cuff checklist was excellent. I think we did the things we had the right kind of photo maps in there that were useful for reference where we were around a given station. I don't think we used them as much as I had anticipated using them. Mainly because navigation was no problem and the points that we had selected pre-flight were excellent points for investigation. There was no need to try to decide on alternative points to try to study in the vicinity of a given station. The list of items to be accomplished at each station are to really, they were mind joggers to read at each station. Again, not as used as much as I thought they would be initially but I think that was made because we both at least I had become so familiar with the items that each station was in itself easy to recall as a result of having created the checklist. The checklist turned out to be more of a learning item rather than a reference item for use on the surface. I wouldn't have done it any differently. I particularly want to compliment the Chuck Lewis on the timeline book that I really can't sing already but the timeline book was very, very well done and very, we had no problems with the timeline book at all. That of course applies to every checklist that we had. There were just no procedural errors that I recall in any of the books that we used. nt the Chuck Lewis on the timeline book that I really can't sing already but the timeline book was very, very well done and very, we had no problems with the timeline book at all. That of course applies to every checklist that we had. There were just no procedural errors that I recall in any of the books that we used. Unfortunately, we didn't have to use an Al-function book or the only one I pulled out the system's data book to check on a system's problem and I can't remember what that was. I thought in the CSM that I would use the Orbiter Charter, which I guess that's what they're called. I had an extra one put on so wouldn't interfere with the planned activities of the CMP. I did not use that very much. I eventually did some sketching on it post-TEI. I think there are about five specific points that I labeled as areas, ABCD, maybe E. I also referenced on my crew notebook for specific observations. In general, I did not put that to as much use as I expected. One item is that that chart should have been identical to the CMP chart and there were a few pen and ink changes left off of it that caused some confusion at one point. I don't know any exposure settings for certain photo targets. The CSM landmark maps that the LNP had added in the rear of that book. Again, we're not used. I really thought I would use those but in the... You became reluctant as you were observing a specific point or area targets, such as Biggeron or something like that, to take time out to sketch on the photo. I tended for the two or three minutes at observation was possible of a given area. I tended to look and then at the first opportunity to take notes in the notebook rather than trying to sketch on the photograph. I suspect that this was because I tended to look for generalizations about the target that I was trying to observe rather than checking out specific individual features. They really did not seem to be any need to make notes about specific points on the pictures and as a result I did not use them. Again, though, I think having selected them and studied them pre-flight made it worth having them around. The necessity for flying them was probably less than the necessity for having reviewed them and studied them. to be any need to make notes about specific points on the pictures and as a result I did not use them. Again, though, I think having selected them and studied them pre-flight made it worth having them around. The necessity for flying them was probably less than the necessity for having reviewed them and studied them. I think I still, if I had to do it again, I still would want to have that kind of data available in the spacecraft even though on this particular mission it was not used. I do think though that the CMP used his visual target maps considerably and I did in a couple occasions that used some of the ones that he had again. But for the most part that was post-TEI and I made some notes and sketches on some of those maps. I think that just functioned that there was a lot of time to look at the moon and make a sketch and then look back and fix it up post-TEI. We're in orbit the time just to not exist. As Dick Gordon said a couple years ago and once you start flying the clock is relentless. General flight planning. I was not very closely involved in the flight planning. Ron sort of carried the burden of that. For both Jean and myself the flight plan was excellent. We had no problems with it at all. I'm aware of Tommy Holloway and his people were to be complimented on that. The number of different requirements and experiments and general operational items that were required to be integrated one with the other was very, very high and it was done in an extremely competent and usable way. I can't think of anything that I would change in the way the flight plan was written. Okay 2335 pre-flight support. Pre-flight support was excellent in the flight data file area and one specific item that I had was once the flight plan was well established just about at the final stage. I had two or three textile and two or three briefing sessions where in the portions of the orbit flight plan that I was going to be during which I was going to be in the spacecraft and the CSM. We went over in detail the attitudes and maneuvers and the available window availability so that I was able to plan in a very short amount of time with minimal effort on my part. I had my own personal observations of the lunar surface and which went very well as far as planning was concerned. spacecraft and the CSM. We went over in detail the attitudes and maneuvers and the available window availability so that I was able to plan in a very short amount of time with minimal effort on my part. I had my own personal observations of the lunar surface and which went very well as far as planning was concerned. I appreciated that that was extra above and beyond the call of duty on the part of the flight planners and I appreciated of their taking time out to do that for me. I think it was useful to have the, I think it was a day long session where the flight controllers and the crew and the flight planners sat around in one room and went over those portions of the flight plan which were not normally simulated. It turned out that the flight plan had been so well done that I doubt if there were any specific items that came up that we needed to do change or there seemed to be a lack of coordination on. This was in contrast to previous flights where I think we were still learning all of us were learning on how to put together flight plans and integrate requirements. So, 7th of the policy 17 flight plan apparently reached the peak of perfection. I was a little bit disappointed in that briefing and that some of the people who would be eventually and randomly involved in the mission were not at the flight plan review. I think this was because of conflicts with other programs which were the center that was carrying out at the time. Okay, 24.0 visual sightings. Well, we've covered the countdown and launch I think pretty well in the previous sections. Also, part flight Earth orbit I think the transcript would cover the visual sightings that I made with respect to weather and a few geographic observations and that same would go for the extensive weather observations that I tried to make our trans lunar. Trans Earth we had only a small crescent of an Earth and it was not feasible to do an extensive weather observations. I don't know whether I recorded yet that although we had light flashes just about continuously during the whole flight when you were dark adapted and I may have even had one which I thought was a flash on the lunar surface. During the first rev that one period of time when we had the blindfolds on to the op-met experiment there just were no visible flashes. Although the next that evening that night before I went to sleep I noticed I was seeing the light flashes again. y have even had one which I thought was a flash on the lunar surface. During the first rev that one period of time when we had the blindfolds on to the op-met experiment there just were no visible flashes. Although the next that evening that night before I went to sleep I noticed I was seeing the light flashes again. So it just seemed to be that one interval either side of that interval and either side of it where the light flash phenomena was not visible to myself or to the other two crewmen. I think the transcript and my crew notebook would cover all the visual sightings that I can remember at this stage without going over it by orbit and feature by feature with the photography and I think that has to come later. Entry recovered in the previous briefings and I think the same goes for lighting and recovery. I want you to stop at a second text. 25.0 pre-mission planning for the LNP. It's hard to think once again of anything that we didn't do right. I'm sure that might have been different had we had problems on the flight but right away the flight went. The total plan, the integration of the mission requirements into that plan. Although there were periods of some difficulty pre-flight particularly in the area of medical requirements. And in some last minute possible scientific requirements particularly on the samples everything seemed to get resolved satisfactory in years I could tell. I can't think of anything that was not handled very well between the people who were leveling the requirements and the flight planners in particular and occasionally when the crew had to be involved that was handled almost entirely by the support crew, Bob Parker in the science area and Courtney Florken and Bob Overfiring in the operational area. There were no significant spacecraft changes in the course of our training period. Ron, I guess the biggest single area that took time was the one that Ron had to deal with and that was a little sounder. Most of our out-safe changes were all taken care of prior to our training and we had a few minor suggestions at once. Suggestions that were taken care of early in the training cycle and we essentially had an up-to-date, out-safe, to train with. And all other lunar surface gear was up to date for most of the 12 month training period or the final 12 months of the training period. ur training and we had a few minor suggestions at once. Suggestions that were taken care of early in the training cycle and we essentially had an up-to-date, out-safe, to train with. And all other lunar surface gear was up to date for most of the 12 month training period or the final 12 months of the training period. The rules and techniques were fairly well defined very early by Phil Schaeffer and his crowd and the techniques area and the mission rules are very griffin and people working on that. No major changes and only the only changes were all I felt in the right direction and that they enhanced the probability of making a landing and a successful mission. Generally, we were in the area of opening up possibilities for workarounds so that a mission could be completed. We really never had to exercise any significant, any of the mission rules in a normal way. I think the one time that mission rule tended to, at least finish this chapter. The mission rule tended to be fairly clearly a controlling factor was in the limitation on the work at station 4 or shorting crater where we were up against the walk-back constraints and terminated that work after only 35 minutes where another. 30 minutes there I think would have been extremely valuable although I hope that we got nothing information that the phenomena exposed at that crater can be understood. 26.0 mission control. Typically outstanding support for mission control. I think this includes the number of extracurricular hours that the LIM people and the e-commerce for the CSM in particular put in with me on Saturdays and other times just generally talking over systems and techniques, mission rules. I was a major factor in helping me understand and keep up to speed on those items. I think the help that they gave me in designing and in fact essentially did the design of the emergency cue cards that we did for Apollo 17 for the LIM where it was a major contribution. Although fortunately we did not use them, they still made it possible to understand very quickly systems problems and to solve those problems in the simulations and had we require them I think it would have gone very well. I particularly want to point out the help that Dick Thorsten gave in organizing most of the LIM sessions and even some of the joint CSM LIM sessions that we had. He also Thorsten also was a major organizer of the creation of and the updating of those emergency cue cards. Human factors 27.0. ould have gone very well. I particularly want to point out the help that Dick Thorsten gave in organizing most of the LIM sessions and even some of the joint CSM LIM sessions that we had. He also Thorsten also was a major organizer of the creation of and the updating of those emergency cue cards. Human factors 27.0. Let's go back. One other comment on 26.0. Post-flight, it's my understanding that some of the things I had hoped could be done during the flight were not possible because of real time discussions in the mission control. Specifically one of those things was to have some summary of the thinking of the science background given to me while in flight and that would be the thinking based on the data that we had transmitted to them verbally and to essentially through the television. I had hoped that I would have the benefit of their thinking but apparently this was not possible to do. I would like to think that in the future we can look at ways of using the team approach to science investigations in space rather than depending solely on the observational capability and the capability. Of the men who are performing the job. There's no reason that I can see it to not use all the brain power that's available for any given task and part of that brain power is on the ground. Okay 27.0. Human factors, pre-flight. The brunt of the discussions and organization from the truth point of view of the pre-flight health stabilization control program was born by the commander and the LNP just sort of went along with whatever was decided. I personally did not find any great difficulty in working out and adhering to the requirements of that program. Medical care, all very limited requirement was good. A couple of sinus infections I had reacted just like they always had and we were able to get those cleared up for 10 days or two weeks. Time for exercise probably was less than it should have been although I was able to get a good workout just about every other day in addition to the workouts we got as a normal course of our EVA training. Eventually, the techs started scheduling and putting on the schedule time in the late afternoon for exercise and that helped as a reminder and buffer to see that that exercise was obtained. It is generally hard in the at least in the lunar training program to get exercise periods in during the day and quite frequently the exercise was done in the Cape Gym at night. ting on the schedule time in the late afternoon for exercise and that helped as a reminder and buffer to see that that exercise was obtained. It is generally hard in the at least in the lunar training program to get exercise periods in during the day and quite frequently the exercise was done in the Cape Gym at night. I think rest and sleep is an individual thing and I made a particular effort to always get as much as I possibly could and try never to get behind the park or unrest because my personal experience is that that is when I tend to get goals and resulting sinus infections. Medical briefing was good. The exams seemed to go very well in my estimation. They were as expeditious as possible under the circumstances. I think the operational medical personnel who carried out the exams are to be complemented in their efforts to see that the exam was as painless and as efficient as possible. This should also include the post-flight exams on the Taikon-Doroga. Eating habits and amount of food consumption were normal except during those periods of time when we were on the inflight food prior to launch. In my case, there was a decrease in appetite and certainly the food was certainly a power. My appetite did go down and it was not possible for me to eat the amount of food that was provided for me. This also applied to space work but in the case of the inflight eating although I did not eat everything that was available to me and my food packages I apparently should have needed to if I hadn't wanted to avoid losing weight. My appetite was down but also apparently for some reason I had a loss of weight and at this time of this recording my weight is still down and is not going up to pre-flight levels which may have been a little high by the way. Okay, 17.2 flight appetite and food preference. Well, I just discussed that a little bit and the appetite in flight versus 2-H pre-flight was less again except for when we were testing the pre-flight food when I also had a low appetite. I had no notable differences in the taste of food. I think the things I like pre-flight, I liked in space and the things I didn't like I also didn't like. I didn't notice any differences. I had a change in food preferences of flight progressed. I tended to start to prefer to eat the wet packs and eat those in preference to any of the other solid foods. taste of food. I think the things I like pre-flight, I liked in space and the things I didn't like I also didn't like. I didn't notice any differences. I had a change in food preferences of flight progressed. I tended to start to prefer to eat the wet packs and eat those in preference to any of the other solid foods. I would strongly recommend, from my personal point of view, at any rate that the wet packs be used in preference to the rehydratable. I know I think that probably you get a different opinion from the other crewmen. The juices were good after the first period of one and only period of difficulty with loose bowel movements I did cut out the potassium, indicated foods. I didn't have any other bowel movements and certainly no more loose ones before the end of the flight. The first problem with after flight on a ton of tython of roger was normal. The second was very loose, the third was normal and the fourth and fifth very loose. The size of food portions and the meal portions were pretty much constant in terms of availability. The chocolate was good, I think of the dry crackers or cookies or graham crackers were probably the most tasty. The peanut butter and jelly sandwiches were quite good. Deviations from the menu and the periods are all recorded in the flight transcripts I'm sure. Food preparation and consumption. The rehydration went, I think, normally and the normal gas was present. Food temperature tended to prefer the foods that were warm or hot and the hot water was quite adequate for warm foods. I think the warm foods were considerably in the limb where the hot water was not available. I did not notice an effective water flavor, it was reasonably tasty. I never noticed a high chlorine taste of any kind. The gas content did make it uncomfortable to eat at times. The food packaging worked pretty well, although those that were finally divided tended to cut off the other end of the package, the water insertion end and use them as a squeezed package. Spoon's worked perfectly adequate. I attended not to use the fruit in the cans because of just the messiness of opening and those although they're, I think, the technique that Ron worked out was really good. Ron worked out, hoping that in your inner, inner, near your mouth is a good one. e them as a squeezed package. Spoon's worked perfectly adequate. I attended not to use the fruit in the cans because of just the messiness of opening and those although they're, I think, the technique that Ron worked out was really good. Ron worked out, hoping that in your inner, inner, near your mouth is a good one. Putteams and this kind of thing were very good. It was only the fruits, the canned fruits that I tended to avoid just because they were inconvenient to use. Food bars and during the EVAs, I think were good to have although I never ate more than half of one. It wasn't because it was untastey, it just because of a lack of interest in eating and using that time during the EVAs. I think after the EVAs, before and after EVAs in the LEM ate very well. There were some things that we avoided. In my case, after one, having corn chowder once and that simulating a major valve limit, although not a loose one. I did not eat corn chowder, I did not eat the cocoa, because I tended to feel like I got a little more gas from cocoa and after taste I did not eat the shrimp, the seafood, the item shrimp and the lobster biscuits and these sort of things. Because of the pre-flight I had noticed that they tended to have a long after taste. Otherwise, I think all the other foods were certainly acceptable. I did not eat potato-based foods because they were very filling. I did not eat the shrimp, I did not eat the shrimp, because they were very filling. I did not eat the shrimp, because it was very filling. in the pouch. I don't know whether that would be possible to do or not. It seems to me it would a little tube dispenser of some kind where they came out more easily. You didn't. Tendi, we generally just cut the corner off a pouch and squeezed them out but it did, it was a little inconvenient, nothing major. We used the germicidal tablets, I did in all the juice bags and the food, spoon bowl bags and the wet packs. I did not use them in the tea and coffee. Under the herbal odors really except for the passing of gas occasionally by the other crewmen and occasionally by myself. Under the herbal odors were a nothing major. We used the germicidal tablets, I did in all the juice bags and the food, spoon bowl bags and the wet packs. I did not use them in the tea and coffee. Under the herbal odors really except for the passing of gas occasionally by the other crewmen and occasionally by myself. Under the herbal odors were a little tube dispenser. I did not find that the atmosphere was unpleasant as a general rule. I might say that I generally had a continuous, almost continuous passage of gas, most of which apparently was not with significant order. Only occasionally that seemed to be objectionable to the other crewmen. I think most of that was the water gas. The reason I think that upon eating, upon starting to eat there would be an increased desire to pass gas, increased pressure in my stomach apparently, it was transmitted almost immediately into the bowels and after eating it would pass gas for a couple hours to three hours. Just before eating the next time the desire would have pretty well dissipated and then it would start again immediately upon eating. Before any digestion was possible I am sure so I suspect water gas was the main culprit in the LNP's gas problem which were not significant. Quantity of food eating on the lunar surface I think was high although probably no more than half of that food that was available. It is hard to say exactly and I think that could be worked out. Maybe with a detail look at the menus if that is desirable. To estimate the quantity would be very difficult. Food quantity of food discarded on the lunar surface would be difficult without looking at the detail menus and checking off those items that I am sure I ate. It is a style of fecal content. We use a blue bag. The blue bag is not a bad way to defecate unless the stool is loose. If it is loose it is just about impossible to use. I don't know what you do in your garage for loose stool. I don't know of any clever way to prevent that being a problem. I am not even sure whatever the sky will have people are using will prevent that from being a problem. The best thing you can do is to work out prevention of loose stools rather than trying to handle them after you get them. A loose stool is one of the major hygiene and sanitary and operational problems that you can have on a flight. I can't emphasize that more. If it happened on a regular basis from being a problem. The best thing you can do is to work out prevention of loose stools rather than trying to handle them after you get them. A loose stool is one of the major hygiene and sanitary and operational problems that you can have on a flight. I can't emphasize that more. If it happened on a regular basis on a daily basis you would I think eventually cut the efficiency of the crew member with the problem by a significant percentage. Possibly as much as 30 percent depending on the magnitude of the problem. I think it is important to try to understand why poly 17 was different than 16 and at least in the delay of a problem with loose stools until about the 11th or 12th day. In case the commander had no problem with loose stools and my personal opinion at this point based on very little information other than observation and flight and thinking about levels of electrolyte intake is that with the electrolyte quantity down from that imposed on the Apollo 16 that we did not reach the electrolyte saturation level until the 11th or 12th day in terms of this CMP and the LMP and in terms of the commander because his electrolyte intake was generally less I think and that can be documented. He did not reach the saturation level at all. When that saturation level was reached however in the last few days of the CMP and LMP I suspect that the electrolytes we were eating were dumped in a sensor concentrated in the intestines and tended to act pretty much as a laxity and as an absence all type laxity if you will in concentrated water in the stool. I think it is important for skyline of that first of all we probably reduce the electrolyte intake so that saturation is never reached and secondly that if loose stool problem develops it appears to be an electrolyte problem other than any other biological problem. That is the problem that we have in the last few days of the CMP and LMP and LMP is not ab